My brain is not wired to listen simultaneously to Russian with a female translator at the same time speaking English most of which I did not hear correctly.. Mr.Lavrov speaks impeccable English so why he chose to speak Russian is beyond me. He is speaking before an international body, and the world needs to hear what he has to say. Too bad.
Simply because he is Russia’s foreign minister. Have you ever seen the State Secretary of the US using a foreign language to address to the UN? Carlos RG
[from Blue] Hard to hear. I’m downloading it and will try listening in player software that has a spectrum filter thing to adjust the magnitude of the frequencies — see if I can filter some of Lavrov’s deeper voice out.
Troparion on the Exaltation of the Holy Life Giving Cross
Ὕψωσις τοῦ Τιμίου καὶ Ζωοποιοῦ Σταυροῦ[1]
“O Lord, save Thy people, and bless Thine inheritance! Grant victory to the Orthodox Christians* over their adversaries, and by virtue of Thy cross, preserve Thy habitation.”
Kontakion (Tone 4) As You were voluntarily raised upon the cross for our sake, Grant mercy to those who are called by Your Name, O Christ God; Make all Orthodox Christians glad by Your power, Granting them victories over their adversaries, By bestowing on them the Invincible trophy, Your weapon of Peace.
The translator is on the right speaker and Lavrov on the left — just change the balance between the speakers and it can be heard perfectly — actually a very good way of doing things.
El Murid: military talks took place today in Gorlovka. Moscow sent general Alexander Lentsov who assumed an openly sharp anti-Novorossiya position. He demanded unilateral withdrawals of the Army of Novorossiya, their unilateral immediate ceasefire, and threatened with closing borders and assistance denial
Henry Kissinger recommends West should take constructive approach to Russia.
What a warrior king Lavrov is!!! “we should not allow national egoism to prevail over collective responsibility” Great summation to a well delivered speech and, by the way, Kudos to the simultaneous translator who kept up with his headlong pace really well. He made a very important point about Libya’s chemical weapons needing to be accounted for by the UN. There are those who claim that some have already made their way into the hands of Turkish intelligence and others. Lavrov rocks!!!
Calumny! This guy smiles and it give me the creeps.
How about urging all sides to resolve the crisis, or how about urging the, I never attack those with weapons directly, color revolutionary master, and destroyer of worlds to resolve the crisis?
Or how about urging the IMF to stop funding a fratricidal war? That would be impossible without their blood money?
More to the point, permit me to urge you, Ki-moon, to refresh yourself with the UN charter.I think it say something about not lying?
Your inference is unbalanced, inflammatory, supportive of a fictional myth as to who is responsible for sowing chaos in Ukraine.
It is quite clear (to me,at least) that Lavrov should have delivered his speech in English (as we’ve seen, he speaks English quite well). He could have begun his speech by saying: “I have chosen today to speak in English rather than in Russian because I want my message to be perfectly clear to Americans and Europeans, especially to those people who are actively engaged in aggression directed against my country.” He might have added, but, of course, being a diplomat, he would not: “Furthermore I don’t trust the UN-appointed interpreter to translate my message without distorting it.”
I have great respect for Lavrov and Putin, but they’re not perfect, and they make mistakes (hopefully none fatal to their cause). Lavrov’s decision to deliver his speech in Russian is one example. His choice of Russian ensures that no-one, other than those people who understand Russian, will take much notice of what he said. An opportunity missed to tell the Western psychopaths clearly that they, not Russia, are the aggressors and that their diabolical plans will come to naught.
@ Gerry1211, 27 September, 2014 22:41 > My brain is not wired to listen simultaneously …
Don’t worry, you’re not alone with this. RT have been practising this kind of “audio editing” since ages. The sheer incompetence of the RT staff in charge boggles the mind. Or is it deliberate to put people off and to drive them away from the channel? One can never tell these days what’s going on in Russia’s rotten msm. Just compare the search results for the name Strelkov on Russian msm and on western msm …
… crazy, isn’t it?! And to top it all off, last December Vladimir Putin has managed to rid the country of its last halfway decent international radio station when he shut down VoR … probably following the advice of some of his trusted 5th column rats. It’s hopeless, really.
Last night an unprecedented meeting took place – between Ukrainian generals and Novorossia military leadership, with Russan military and OSCE as observers. They pulled out a map of Ukraine and talked about where the border between Novorossia and Ukraine should be. (Russian news program Vesti)
Kiev is grabbing people on the streets to exchange them for POW’s. Novorossiya side halted the POW exchange, since the flow of Novorosia POW’s, according to reqused lists, has been replaced by random people, who have nothing to do with Novorossiya. The question is, where are the Novrossiya POW’s – dead?
@ Greg Schofield, 28 September, 2014 02:05 > … actually a very good way of doing things.
No, it’ not. Listening simultaneously to two different voices speaking two different languages at identical audio levels makes it very hard to understand what is being said in either language … and adjusting the stereo balance isn’t an option for people who are trying to listening to Sergey Lavrov’s speech in public places (RT always pride themselves on being available globally in 25 billion airport lounges and in 100 trillion hotels). Apart from this RT uploaded this video to their English language channel which targets an English speaking audience. Leaving Lavrov’s original audio track at 50% volume is absolutely inappropriate and unprofessional.
Lavrov had an opportunity to fire a shot that would be heard and understood by potentially billions of people. No matter it would be ignored by the media. Online it could reverberate forever. This is a failure to take the bull by the horns. I know the Russian game is patient but in respect of the medium, message and timing, Lavrov missed a glorious opportunity.
The argument that no one has a monopoly on truth seems to be plucked from Western Relativists in the first place. It makes me naseous to hear it from Lavrov at this time. What good is to say you have your truth while we have ours when what Lavrov should be saying is that Russia is on the side of ultimate truth.
That may not be a fair interpretation of Lavrov’s words but I am seriously disappointed.
Some people just don’t understand the importance of language to a culture…they’re so “spoiled” at having their mother tongue be the language they listen to, that they can’t comprehend other people wanting to hear their language in “important” situations. IMP these people are missing the entire point of the United Nations and International relations.
Talk about mission creep in the Internet age. It took a few years with Vietnam but already in a week, Turkey is ready to send in troops into Syria.
This is the same Turkey that supplied the Sarine gas and killed all those Syrians last year? Turkey is involved in most of the wars the US is involved in but they usually always have a UN mandate and fall under the UN commander who is mostly an American.
Why is Lavrov talking in Russian? If he wants to influence people in other countries he should have talked in English because other wise we only hear the lies and nothing from the other side. How many people are going to go find out what Lavrov said? It sure wont be published in any western media. Heck most TV would show him speaking in Russian and scroll what Obama said at the UN and people would think it was Lavrov who said that.
Dalpe, the odious Ban was known, I believe, to the South Koreans as ‘the slippery eel’. A perfect selection for Imperial stooge, although not as grotesque as the hideous Kofi Annan. The last even quarter-way decent UNSG was Boutros-Ghali, was terminated with moderate prejudice by the USA because of very slight crimes of hesitancy in executing Imperial orders. In the Real Evil Empire total submission is absolutely mandatory. We in Australia have been blessed by a succession of leaders whose groveling has been exemplary.
Looks like there is a limit. Maybe it is not too late. But still, most of the people are still iving in la la land no matter where they live. People need to wake up and start finding lamp posts to hang the suckers who seem hell bent on killing us all.
Lavrov: High time to rearm, Moscow’s military upgrade long overdue
“They even violate the agreements we have, which makes us wonder whether it is even possible to have any agreements with them at all,” Lavrov said.
Mulga Mumblebrain do you think anyone who is hostile to western imperialism will get to take top posts in any organization? Kofi Annan failed in many areas but would it be better to have samantha powers in charge instead? We should not put everything on the shoulders of those who can not do anything in the post. I am sure he worked in the confines of his cage. The best example would be to give the Nobel peace prize to the likes of Obama and refuse Gandhi 5 times. Everyone else know they need to set up alternatives but after 20 years they are not even up and running yet. You also need a lot of money for such things. As they say might is power and power is money. Kofi tried to stop the Iraq war and was ineffective but it happened anyway. He most likely lost influence to do anything else as well. Can you name a single international organization that works on the principle of all states and equal and equality for all?
” So, I hope that this decision in Ukraine is not the final one and can be reviewed again, because this is about both: this is about safety and this is about economy of the country. And if the decision to use the US-origin fuel will be implemented, it can create additional problems in the Ukrainian economy, as well as create challenges to nuclear safety in that country.
And people in Ukraine remember well how important safety is, because Chernobyl nuclear power plant, which is shut down right now, actually is located on the territory of Ukraine.
Again, unfortunately, the experience, which the European countries had of using Westinghouse-origin fuel, is not widely publicized, though it is quite dramatic and should be further promoted among the public opinion. “
It is quite clear (to me,at least) that Lavrov should have delivered his speech in English (as we’ve seen, he speaks English quite well). He could have begun his speech by saying: “I have chosen today to speak in English rather than in Russian because I want my message to be perfectly clear to Americans and Europeans, especially to those people who are actively engaged in aggression directed against my country –
I’m of two minds on this
1. The Corporate media would ignore and gloss it over. Doesn’t fit their “script” 2. A great English speech that could be routed virally to the alt news and new media blogs would be ideal to drive a wedge to peel skeptics everywhere to distrust the corporate media as extensions of Obama’s/EU/Nato’s propaganda organ
Lavrov vs. Kerry or Power’s hectoring hypocrisy
The corporate media is a lumbering dinosaur losing its relevance. Blogs are where the action is.
I only read story headlines to see what is being ignored and what is being obfuscated at NYT, WaPoo, Kardashian Post and CIA News Network
Huffington (Kardashian)Post was horrible in their Ukraine coverage. Even the Palestians got a better shake. And forget NPR. Pure govt apologia. National Pentagon Radio
The Ukrainian Civil War and the Gaza Genocide will be looked upon in a decade as the beginning of the end of “mainstream” traditional media
Kiev is grabbing people on the streets to exchange them for POW’s. Novorossiya side halted the POW exchange, since the flow of Novorosia POW’s, according to reqused lists, has been replaced by random people, who have nothing to do with Novorossiya. The question is, where are the Novrossiya POW’s – dead? —
F course they are dead. Prisoners are expensive. Check the organ banks and blood banks in Tel Aviv for what is left
I think Lavrov is making it very clear where Russia/BRICS et al all stand :). —
The BRICS
B – Brazil will fold when Soros’ stooge defeats Roussef I – let’s see where Neoliberal Modi is when he gets his marching orders in DC S- South Africa. Meh
Simply because he is Russia’s foreign minister. Have you ever seen the State Secretary of the US using a foreign language to address to the UN? Carlos RG —-
Who was his speech aimed at?
1. Russian people to shore up impatience over Putin’s “measured” response in Ukraine 2. English has become the lingua Franca for the world primarily through pop music and movies. The West has demonized Putin as a revanchist Soviet Empiricist.
They still blame Russia for MH17 bc people remember the 1983 KAL incident. In that regard it was a brilliant chose for a false flag
Lavrov could have appealed to the integrated world where through entities like the Web, Facebook, Twitter and YouTube, which are American (English) media outlets
Seems to me Putin is very concerned that Russians hear Lavrov take the moral high road to stem off those in Russia getting tired of Putin’s rope a dope strategy. To convince People that Russia is not he west’s doormat/whipping boy
Russia needs to hire some Western marketers bc their marketing always seems to get lost in the Corporate media maelstrom of “if it bleeds, it leads”. They don’t do subtlety bc of the short attention span of American consumers and the belief our media elites have that Joe Sixpack and Sally Housecoat are too stupid to understand the “nuances” anyway
Perhaps Lavrov’s new de facto position as the moral leader of the world….(which Russia has now taken on by default of the US) will encourage English speaking politically minded people to study Russian and the Cyrillic alphabet. During a vacation in Russia this past summer I took a couple of sessions of Russian and can tell you, for instance, that “Peckopah” means “Restaurant”. (P is an R) and it is not that difficult.
lavrow is such a great and capable politician. why, why, why does the west have only $%&/() …aka idiots?
Maybe it is bc they were to long in power w/o any real challenge. I hope that people in the west start to realize that we need a change – and that also includes a change of how “we” deal with our russian brothers.
same time and different kind of brothers: good news from serbia – the gov had the guts to protect the gays having their demonstration. It is a shame that they needed 1000s of police – but same time: thank you serb government! You did the right thing!
I only hope and pray that russia comes to its senses too and understands that they gays are no enemy. The enemy are those politicians like obama who use them for propaganda.
This serbian event – to me and many other gay europeans – is a good sign. why? because after all and understanding how diffiult it is for conservative people, it is a sign into the right direction and – giving some time – it might also open more support from us to you. Payback as in “your protect us” and “we might start to support you”.
this serbian issue is very, very important fo us. understand that many of us do not want to be in conflict with russia. same time what is happening in russia forces us to disagree. that is stupid. we never picked you as an enemy. our “leaders” did.
No one is paying attention in America, Canada or Australia but the rest of the world is nodding in agreement with the belligerent evil of an immoral west
As I try to embrace a Sakerian (how you like that!) view on Putin’s long game rather than be one of Alien Tech’s “benighted” trolls along with sister Katherine, lol…
Anyone think that Putin has deputized Lavrov in a full court press..? He has been everywhere lately
Putin sees himself as anathema to any dialogue with a west brought up on comic book “evil” villains like Saddam, Qadaffi and Bin Laden
So he removes himself from the focus and sends Lavrov out to make the argument that Russia supports negotiations and the West are whiny bullies
Does anyone know how the prisoners are exchanged on the NAF side
Surely they are not exchanging Uki officers or Neo Nazi irregulars out of uniform
Hopefully they are the miserable conscripts 50 and older and thus too long in the tooth just to be cannon fodder in the inevitable Uki counter offensive when the “ceasefire” ends
V of Russia was not shut down, per se, but merged in July 2014 with RIA Novosti. http://www.en.ria.ru
However putin gets blamed for that one, it pales to his setting up that next to useless RT, which barely rates above plain vanilla MSM. There’s also pravda.ru (irony: pravda= truth), & ITAR TASS en.itar-tass.com
Like Paul on the road to Damascus, I am trying to view everything through the Sakerian viewfinder
But this article makes me viscerally agree. My heart is overruling my head
The only I disagree with in this article is I do NOT want Regime change in Moscow. I want Putin to bite back….but I am coming around to Saker’s advice to not expect immediate reaction
In reggae there is a common lyric: don’t mistake my kindness for weakness. Is there a Russian equivalent sentiment?
Gerry2012 Mr.Lavrov speaks impeccable English so why he chose to speak Russian is beyond me.
Serendipity It is quite clear (to me,at least) that Lavrov should have delivered his speech in English (as we’ve seen, he speaks English quite well).
Alien Tech Why is Lavrov talking in Russian? If he wants to influence people in other countries he should have talked in English because other wise we only hear the lies and nothing from the other side.
Classic Troll Fail. There should be a video for this
Many thanks for the Ria Novosti suggestion. I like Lavrov….Currently he seems to be the only diplomat familiar with real diplomacy. The kind unknown to Washington. Would you happen to know whether there is an ap for Ria Novosti for my Android? Cannot find one. I have RT/AlJareera and Press TV but no Ria Novosti… Again many thanks G.
I uploaded an english only version of the Lavrov speech at http://youtu.be/uKXU1k8r8tc lowered the pitch of the female interpreter’s voice as much as I could without making it too artificial and did some other mods — easier to listen to than the right channel of the multiplexed version…
There are far more English speakers accross the world than there are Russian speakers. All HS in the Netherlands for instance require English and French as a choice..English is a “required” language while Russian is not. Lavrov was not addressing Russia but the world. The world does not speak Russian. English is MY second language so your arrogance is based on ignorance, as it so often is. Ever engaged in thinking??? You might be surprised. Have a good one!
Classic Troll Fail. There should be a video for this
@Amerikanski
These are most certainly NOT trolls. Grow up. If everyone thought exactly the same way we would be drooling bots and this site would be just Saker and his fan club
All of those people you besmirched are rooting for Putin and the NR to succeed. As do I.
Troll: Cold N. Haufield at Moon of Alabama
There is more than one way to skin a cat. Constructive criticism for “our” team. Putin is a huge underdog and needs encouragement not blind sycophancy
There are far more English speakers across the world than there are Russian speakers. All HS in the Netherlands for instance require English and French as a choice..English is a “required” language while Russian is not. Lavrov was not addressing Russia but the world. The world does not speak Russian.
Right. It’s true that native English speakers tend to believe (perhaps a bit arrogantly) that everyone else should learn English, but the fact is that English is the de facto international language (as Latin was in Europe for centuries). There is surely some reason (other than the prevalence of American movies) for learning English to be (almost) obligatory in European high schools (also in Asia). Native French speakers may grind their teeth in frustration, but the fact is that English is the world’s lingua franca. As Gerry1211 said, in his UNGS speech Lavrov was addressing the world, not just Russia. Therefore he should have delivered his speech in English. Attempts to render it via what the interpreter said are just not good enough. The Russians have a few things to learn about how to present their position to the rest of the world, and let’s hope they wise up real soon.
Anunnaki, it is a classic troll as I said, because it is irrelevant to the subject and can be argued about till the cows come home without ever addressing the subject — which is I think the content and significance of Lavrov’s speech.
Recall Obama’s tan suit? Troll bait. What did he say? Who knows among all those English speakers who heard him? But they damn well have an opinion about his wardrobe.
“Grow up” Cheap flame.
“All of those people you besmirched are rooting for Putin and the NR to succeed. As do I.”
So, there is Lavrov denouncing the English speaking governments and politicians and asserting the national rights of all nations which the English speaking nations aggressively stress and destroy in front of the assembly of those nations and you think he ought to have spoken to them of this matter in English.
Anunnaki maybe the impatience in actions is due to growing up in a western,r Russian, Chinese, Indian culture. As you know if someone does wrong to you, you get in their face and confront them about it. It would also be uncommon for them to keep shaking hands and behave amicably in the US. With Russians, they will behave the same way as before until they are ready and then show you the door. It might take years for that to happen. The best example of this is how Obama would not be seen with Putin since Putin threw a spanner in the works and the scene between Putin and Poroshenko. I had a hard time understand how Putin could smile at him and shake his hand at the guy who kept demonizing him and calling for his death.
It is difficult to always keep in the back of your mind that they are different cultures since we can all talk to each other so readily. Even when you work with them every day you still forget they dont think like you do. On the other hand you have some south Americans who have a dance party after getting clobbered and thats how they grieve.
English is not Lavrov’s native language. I’ve heard him give interviews in English and sometimes the sentence construction is a little bit off, or the word choice is not quite right. You don’t want him parodied by Jon Stewart. Translators are professional and **hopefully** will get all the nuances right.
What happens if/ when the US (or a US proxy like Qatar/ Saudi Arabia/ UAE) calls the Russian bluff and takes out some Assad Government assets?
It’d be nice if it was on the record rather than via backchannels.
Surely they understand the world’s media will act surprised that Russia would have a problem with US targeting of Assad if they don’t make it explicit that they will defend Assad?
They just allow themselves to be blamed/ framed for an escalation.
Alien Tech you are quite correct. The Empire ensures that all international bodies are headed by stooges. If they stop obeying orders, they are got rid of, like Jose Bustani at the Chemical Weapons Convention, or Boutros-Ghali. But if reliable they are pushed forward, witness the bullying in order to appoint Japanese stooge Amano to the IAEA to lean on Iran etc, etc. I just think that Kofi Annan is a particularly egregious example of an Imperial Stooge.
Gerry and others banging on about the use of English.
Yes, congratulations on being able to speak English. Well done! Sincerely.
However, what none of you are is diplomats.
Yes, Lavrov was addressing an audience from around the world but those in front of him were also diplomats.
Diplomacy is all about meanings and interpretations – kinda like lawyering in that respect.
When Lavrov speaks he does so in a deliberate manner. When he wants meaning to be clear, he is very clear. When he wants his meaning to be open to some degree of interpretation then his words reflect that.
If he speaks in English then he simply can not express himself with the same degree of nuance – none of us can – unless our demands of communication are very basic ‘want food’, ‘want sex’, ‘you pretty woman’.
Around the world people will be examining Lavrov’s words for hidden meanings, trying to find wiggle room that was not intended.
When he speaks the document of record becomes the transcript or recording of what was said. So, it is important to use the best and most clear language for the speaker.
Speaking in Russian is a precaution, a way to ensure that meaning is not lost – after all, the world is full of very competent translators, less well endowed with people who are as good at diplomacy as Lavrov.
There is also, probably, a secondary level involved here. By speaking in Russian Lavrov is making sure that the important part of his audience will have to work just a little harder to understand him, this means that they will pay more attention to his words, even if they read them as a translated transcript rather than as hurriedly taken notes as he spoke. That is good for all of us because we need for the power actors to understand what Russia is saying. We are in this pretty pickle because too many people were too lazy to bother to listen and learn.
Amerikanski…. “Anunnaki, it is a classic troll as I said, because it is irrelevant to the subject and can be argued about till the cows come home without ever addressing the subject — which is I think the content and significance of Lavrov’s speech.”
And the subject was what? If it was to show the world that the U.S. was/is wrong (it is!) it flew by everyone because it wasn’t in English…a BIG mistake!
“Recall Obama’s tan suit? Troll bait. What did he say? Who knows among all those English speakers who heard him? But they damn well have an opinion about his wardrobe.”
You cannot stick to the subject can you? Whatever Obama “says” is in English.
“Grow up” Cheap flame.”
Really time to grow up and engage in some thinking
“All of those people you besmirched are rooting for Putin and the NR to succeed. As do I.”
They sure do.
“So, there is Lavrov denouncing the English speaking governments and politicians and asserting the national rights of all nations which the English speaking nations aggressively stress and destroy in front of the assembly of those nations and you think he ought to have spoken to them of this matter in English.”
If his aim was to have that message understood by Washington and the majority of American brain-dead by addressing the UN in Russian he failed miserably. If his aim was to address the Africans Swahili might have helped, but “blasting the U.S. in Russian is like me blasting you in Dutch. It is nonsense. Mr. Lavrov is most likely the only real diplomat we have walking the globe. He is extremely intelligent, analyzes the issues well and seeks solutions. In the process he recognizes and condemns those who don’t want solutions, exposes their hypocrisy and only want war for their own gain because it i lucrative. When we have a message to deliver to an adversary we do so in a language not only the adversary understands but most of its people who have been programmed to the point of being brain dead do. Are you with me so far. An that ain’t Russian honey!!!
Before you decide to write again I suggest you do some thinking…Mijn volgende antwoord is in het Nederlands. Argumenteer dat maar.
Duty “Gerry and others banging on about the use of English.
Yes, congratulations on being able to speak English. Well done! Sincerely.
However, what none of you are is diplomats.”
And obviously neither are you. And, so it seems, neither have you lived long enough to gain any wisdom on the subject in order to have an opinion. You have some growing up to do in order to participate in grown up discussions.
PS perhaps you can point out 1 American diplomat in Washington (John Kerry is a politician not a diplomat)or even 1 American diplomat at the U.N. Samantha Powers is not a diplomat. So do you have a definition what a diplomat IS, since Washington seems to be clueless. Over to you!!!
Okay I apologize, it was mu mistake. After seeing Lavrov’s interview I thought this was another interview given to the press. I did not realize it was his speech to the UN. And I agree he should give it in his native tongue since there are legal implications in it. Yea I know Americans get in front of it and lie like they are talking to a porn channel viewer ship.
Anonymous “Although perhaps not obvious, not only is Mr. Lavrov intelligent he also has a sense of humour as well as precision”
A sense of humor requires intelligence.
As far as I recall the first Russian information re MH17 was initially in Russian with a painfully poor translator Saker even referred to it.Later it had English sub titles. Worked for me. The second report, the result of Russian engineers was in English. The issue here is that when it comes from Russia I can accept Russian and am willing to wait for decent subtitles or a translation. Their translators are atrocious. But when a man like Lavrov stands in front of the International Community he needs to address them in English. When Frans Timmerman’s Minister of Defence (Netherlands) addressed the U.N. on the MH17 issue he spoke in English. He lied through his teeth but that’s beside the point. The brain dead Dutch sought he was cool and should be rewarded by going to Bussels. While I am glad the Dutch will be well rid of him, he may just prove a far bigger disaster for the EU as a whole. Those who end up in Brussels are almost always the rejects in their own country.Timmermans is an opportunist.
Perhaps it is now clear that Lavrov spoke to the UNGA, and his speech was not off-the-cuff remarks to US reporters in New York.
As a significant speech by a senior Russian diiplomat, be assured every phrase and word was chosen carefully. Consideration would have been given to Russia’s allies; India and China may have been consulted. The speech would have been translated by the Kremlin in English and French certainly, and probably Spanish, and maybe German — all before Lavrov arrived in New York. Various delegations would have already produced executive summaries and talking points for their press offices.
So, I read US news websites dated the same day as Lavrov’s speech quoting a “UN transcript” of his speech in English. Perhaps people in other countries can note the dateline on their news services quoting the speech in their native language.
Or perhaps the doubters might call the Russian delegation at the UN, or if they have a Russian Consulate in their city, and find out how the speech was made available and in which languages.
So, the actual delivery of the speech by Lavrov was ‘spectacle’, ‘performance’, but it was not the substance of the political and diplomatic activity, which occurs off-camera always.
“When Frans Timmerman’s Minister of Defence (Netherlands) addressed the U.N. on the MH17 issue he spoke in English.”
English is an official (recognized regional) language of the Netherlands.
“The Netherlands has a tradition of learning foreign languages, formalized in Dutch education laws. Some 87% of the total population indicate they are able to converse in English, 70% in German, and 29% in French. Children start with English courses at primary schools when they are about four or five years old.”
Gerry, thanks for your comment and thanks for kinda making the point about lack of comprehension for me.
If you read what I wrote you will see that I made no reference to Kerry or anyone else, I was referring to solely to Lavrov and his speech before the UN.
Although you are correct that Kerry is a politician you are incorrect to suggest that he is not engaged in diplomacy. Lavrov is also a government minister but his diplomatic skills are never in question and nobody ever needs to make excuses for him as you have for Kerry. That shows there is a qualitative difference between them in terms of their relative skill sets, although they are nominally peers.
It is hard for people like you to understand what happens around you; but, again, congratulations because you are at least present in this forum and so you have given yourself the chance to learn.
You might want to learn what some of the words we use around here mean because then you will not make mistakes based upon your lack of vocabulary skill.
If there’s something that you do not understand, rather than flying off the handle as you seem to have done in posting a somewhat intemperate reply to my comment about the use of English, ask a question! There’s no shame in asking about that which we do not understand.
If you don’t agree with my (or anyone else’s) analysis of a situation or case then question it, give your fact supported opinion, let us all learn from your insights.
It appears some think the simultaneous translation is significant. I have argued it is not. What is official is the Russian translation and which was already in the diplomatic pouches before Lavrov mounted the podium.
Here is a link to all the official Kremlin English translations of Lavrov’s speeches and interviews.
My brain is not wired to listen simultaneously to Russian with a female translator at the same time speaking English most of which I did not hear correctly..
Mr.Lavrov speaks impeccable English so why he chose to speak Russian is beyond me. He is speaking before an international body, and the world needs to hear what he has to say.
Too bad.
Simply because he is Russia’s foreign minister. Have you ever seen the State Secretary of the US using a foreign language to address to the UN?
Carlos RG
Dear The Saker,
I was wondering when Russia was going to speak at the UN.
Here is a written piece too from RT:
http://www.rt.com/news/191216-lavrov-us-rejects-principle/
I think Lavrov is making it very clear where Russia/BRICS et al all stand :).
Rgds,
Veritas
Saker,
I found an interesting, if somewhat dated, interview with Gleb Pavlovsky in the most recent issue of New left Review. It adds some nuances to what is going on in the Kremlin: http://newleftreview.org/II/88/gleb-pavlovsky-putin-s-world-outlook
/Hagen
Dear The Saker,
What do you think Russia will say about this?:
http://www.rt.com/news/191220-erdogan-turkey-isis-military/
Their game has been so transparent from the start :(
Rgds,
Veritas
Gerry1211,
If you go to Ria Novsti they have broken down all the main points of Lavrov’s speech into articles which you can read.
Dear The Saker,
http://en.ria.ru/world/20140927/193367669/UN-Declaration-Needed-to-Prevent-Use-of-Coup-as-Means-to-Change-Regime.html
I do like this point by Lavrov – about time too!
Rgds,
Veritas
Gerry1211: despabilate amigo – el mundo es bien ancho (wake up buddy, the world’s a big place)
[from Blue]
Hard to hear. I’m downloading it and will try listening in player software that has a spectrum filter thing to adjust the magnitude of the frequencies — see if I can filter some of Lavrov’s deeper voice out.
I just know that the peckerwood that was in charge of the translating deliberately muted the voice over so that Lavrov’s message was indecipherable.
The UN is proving to be another League of Nations.
My apologies, here is a version of the speak that is understandable
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqcQQaLvlkM
I retract my retraction. That last link was from 2 years ago.
When Lavrov speaks it’s an assault [according to MSM], fortunately, when Obombi opens his claptrap, it’s an insult.
Even Kafka watches all this unfold with raised eyebrows.
“…Mr.Lavrov speaks impeccable English so why he chose to speak Russian is beyond me.”
********************
This is the United Nations…not the English Nations…your ethnocentricity is appalling.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZR5O5-OxIYE
Troparion on the Exaltation of the Holy Life Giving Cross
Ὕψωσις τοῦ Τιμίου καὶ Ζωοποιοῦ Σταυροῦ[1]
“O Lord, save Thy people,
and bless Thine inheritance!
Grant victory to the Orthodox Christians*
over their adversaries,
and by virtue of Thy cross,
preserve Thy habitation.”
http://orthodoxwiki.org/Elevation_of_the_Holy_Cross
Kontakion (Tone 4)
As You were voluntarily raised upon the cross for our sake,
Grant mercy to those who are called by Your Name, O Christ God;
Make all Orthodox Christians glad by Your power,
Granting them victories over their adversaries,
By bestowing on them the Invincible trophy, Your weapon of Peace.
The translator is on the right speaker and Lavrov on the left — just change the balance between the speakers and it can be heard perfectly — actually a very good way of doing things.
El Murid: military talks took place today in Gorlovka. Moscow sent general Alexander Lentsov who assumed an openly sharp anti-Novorossiya position. He demanded unilateral withdrawals of the Army of Novorossiya, their unilateral immediate ceasefire, and threatened with closing borders and assistance denial
Henry Kissinger recommends West should take constructive approach to Russia.
http://en.itar-tass.com/world/751643
What a warrior king Lavrov is!!! “we should not allow national egoism to prevail over collective responsibility” Great summation to a well delivered speech and, by the way, Kudos to the simultaneous translator who kept up with his headlong pace really well.
He made a very important point about Libya’s chemical weapons needing to be accounted for by the UN. There are those who claim that some have already
made their way into the hands of Turkish intelligence and others. Lavrov rocks!!!
Report from UN: Ki-moon, “UN urged Russia to resolve the Ukrainian crisis.” http://translate.yandex.net/tr-url/ru-en.ru/www.novorosinform.org/news/id/10242
Calumny! This guy smiles and it give me the creeps.
How about urging all sides to resolve the crisis, or how about urging the, I never attack those with weapons directly, color revolutionary master, and destroyer of worlds to resolve the crisis?
Or how about urging the IMF to stop funding a fratricidal war? That would be impossible without their blood money?
More to the point, permit me to urge you, Ki-moon, to refresh yourself with the UN charter.I think it say something about not lying?
Your inference is unbalanced, inflammatory, supportive of a fictional myth as to who is responsible for sowing chaos in Ukraine.
It is quite clear (to me,at least) that Lavrov should have delivered his speech in English (as we’ve seen, he speaks English quite well). He could have begun his speech by saying: “I have chosen today to speak in English rather than in Russian because I want my message to be perfectly clear to Americans and Europeans, especially to those people who are actively engaged in aggression directed against my country.” He might have added, but, of course, being a diplomat, he would not: “Furthermore I don’t trust the UN-appointed interpreter to translate my message without distorting it.”
I have great respect for Lavrov and Putin, but they’re not perfect, and they make mistakes (hopefully none fatal to their cause). Lavrov’s decision to deliver his speech in Russian is one example. His choice of Russian ensures that no-one, other than those people who understand Russian, will take much notice of what he said. An opportunity missed to tell the Western psychopaths clearly that they, not Russia, are the aggressors and that their diabolical plans will come to naught.
@ Gerry1211, 27 September, 2014 22:41
> My brain is not wired to listen simultaneously …
Don’t worry, you’re not alone with this. RT have been practising this kind of “audio editing” since ages. The sheer incompetence of the RT staff in charge boggles the mind. Or is it deliberate to put people off and to drive them away from the channel? One can never tell these days what’s going on in Russia’s rotten msm. Just compare the search results for the name Strelkov on Russian msm and on western msm …
Yandex:
http://www.yandex.com/video/search?text=Strelkov
YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Strelkov
… crazy, isn’t it?! And to top it all off, last December Vladimir Putin has managed to rid the country of its last halfway decent international radio station when he shut down VoR … probably following the advice of some of his trusted 5th column rats. It’s hopeless, really.
Last night an unprecedented meeting took place – between Ukrainian generals and Novorossia military leadership, with Russan military and OSCE as observers. They pulled out a map of Ukraine and talked about where the border between Novorossia and Ukraine should be. (Russian news program Vesti)
Kiev is grabbing people on the streets to exchange them for POW’s. Novorossiya side halted the POW exchange, since the flow of Novorosia POW’s, according to reqused lists, has been replaced by random people, who have nothing to do with Novorossiya. The question is, where are the Novrossiya POW’s – dead?
That’s terrible. God knows who they are. Eternal Memory.
100 million tons of highest quality oil discovered in the Arctic by Rosneft, comparable to entire reserves of Saudi Arabia.
@ Greg Schofield, 28 September, 2014 02:05
> … actually a very good way of doing things.
No, it’ not. Listening simultaneously to two different voices speaking two different languages at identical audio levels makes it very hard to understand what is being said in either language … and adjusting the stereo balance isn’t an option for people who are trying to listening to Sergey Lavrov’s speech in public places (RT always pride themselves on being available globally in 25 billion airport lounges and in 100 trillion hotels). Apart from this RT uploaded this video to their English language channel which targets an English speaking audience. Leaving Lavrov’s original audio track at 50% volume is absolutely inappropriate and unprofessional.
I with the Anglo ethnocentrists on this one.
Lavrov had an opportunity to fire a shot that would be heard and understood by potentially billions of people. No matter it would be ignored by the media. Online it could reverberate forever. This is a failure to take the bull by the horns. I know the Russian game is patient but in respect of the medium, message and timing, Lavrov missed a glorious opportunity.
The argument that no one has a monopoly on truth seems to be plucked from Western Relativists in the first place. It makes me naseous to hear it from Lavrov at this time. What good is to say you have your truth while we have ours when what Lavrov should be saying is that Russia is on the side of ultimate truth.
That may not be a fair interpretation of Lavrov’s words but I am seriously disappointed.
@ greencrow,
Q: This is the United Nations…not the English Nations…your ethnocentricity is appalling.
R: Give it a few decades and we’ll all be fluent in Mandarin :o)
Some people just don’t understand the importance of language to a culture…they’re so “spoiled” at having their mother tongue be the language they listen to, that they can’t comprehend other people wanting to hear their language in “important” situations. IMP these people are missing the entire point of the United Nations and International relations.
Talk about mission creep in the Internet age. It took a few years with Vietnam but already in a week, Turkey is ready to send in troops into Syria.
This is the same Turkey that supplied the Sarine gas and killed all those Syrians last year? Turkey is involved in most of the wars the US is involved in but they usually always have a UN mandate and fall under the UN commander who is mostly an American.
Why is Lavrov talking in Russian? If he wants to influence people in other countries he should have talked in English because other wise we only hear the lies and nothing from the other side. How many people are going to go find out what Lavrov said? It sure wont be published in any western media. Heck most TV would show him speaking in Russian and scroll what Obama said at the UN and people would think it was Lavrov who said that.
Dalpe, the odious Ban was known, I believe, to the South Koreans as ‘the slippery eel’. A perfect selection for Imperial stooge, although not as grotesque as the hideous Kofi Annan. The last even quarter-way decent UNSG was Boutros-Ghali, was terminated with moderate prejudice by the USA because of very slight crimes of hesitancy in executing Imperial orders. In the Real Evil Empire total submission is absolutely mandatory. We in Australia have been blessed by a succession of leaders whose groveling has been exemplary.
Little bit of topic, but also from EU
http://libertyblitzkrieg.com/2014/06/19/video-of-the-day-end-the-fed-rallies-are-exploding-throughout-germany/
@Lumpy Gravy and others
The translation is perfect. You just have to use the left/right stereo balance to choose for Russian (left channel) or Englisch (on the right channel)
Rgrds
Listened to speech without understanding anything, the language of Russia is beautiful and the transcript I will read later.
Chesnokov helps in understanding differences in psychology between Russia and the west.
http://youtu.be/g8CpbSxBC_Q
we praise thee
we bless thee
we give thanks unto thee. o lord
and we pray to thee our god
Looks like there is a limit. Maybe it is not too late. But still, most of the people are still iving in la la land no matter where they live. People need to wake up and start finding lamp posts to hang the suckers who seem hell bent on killing us all.
Lavrov: High time to rearm, Moscow’s military upgrade long overdue
“They even violate the agreements we have, which makes us wonder whether it is even possible to have any agreements with them at all,” Lavrov said.
http://rt.com/news/191268-lavrov-interview-arms-race/
Mulga Mumblebrain do you think anyone who is hostile to western imperialism will get to take top posts in any organization? Kofi Annan failed in many areas but would it be better to have samantha powers in charge instead? We should not put everything on the shoulders of those who can not do anything in the post. I am sure he worked in the confines of his cage. The best example would be to give the Nobel peace prize to the likes of Obama and refuse Gandhi 5 times. Everyone else know they need to set up alternatives but after 20 years they are not even up and running yet. You also need a lot of money for such things. As they say might is power and power is money. Kofi tried to stop the Iraq war and was ineffective but it happened anyway. He most likely lost influence to do anything else as well. Can you name a single international organization that works on the principle of all states and equal and equality for all?
Off Topic
Oh crap.
” So, I hope that this decision in Ukraine is not the final one and can be reviewed again, because this is about both: this is about safety and this is about economy of the country. And if the decision to use the US-origin fuel will be implemented, it can create additional problems in the Ukrainian economy, as well as create challenges to nuclear safety in that country.
And people in Ukraine remember well how important safety is, because Chernobyl nuclear power plant, which is shut down right now, actually is located on the territory of Ukraine.
Again, unfortunately, the experience, which the European countries had of using Westinghouse-origin fuel, is not widely publicized, though it is quite dramatic and should be further promoted among the public opinion. “
http://en.ria.ru/burning_point/20140925/193277183/Kiev-Decision-Creates-New-Risk-to-Nuclear-Security-in-Europe.html
@Dalpe
Report from UN: Ki-moon, “UN urged Russia to resolve the Ukrainian crisis.” http://translate.yandex.net/tr-url/ru-en.ru/www.novorosinform.org/news/id/10242
Calumny! This guy smiles and it give me the creeps.
—
The UN is just another garden variety US controlled NGO
It is quite clear (to me,at least) that Lavrov should have delivered his speech in English (as we’ve seen, he speaks English quite well). He could have begun his speech by saying: “I have chosen today to speak in English rather than in Russian because I want my message to be perfectly clear to Americans and Europeans, especially to those people who are actively engaged in aggression directed against my country
–
I’m of two minds on this
1. The Corporate media would ignore and gloss it over. Doesn’t fit their “script”
2. A great English speech that could be routed virally to the alt news and new media blogs would be ideal to drive a wedge to peel skeptics everywhere to distrust the corporate media as extensions of Obama’s/EU/Nato’s propaganda organ
Lavrov vs. Kerry or Power’s hectoring hypocrisy
The corporate media is a lumbering dinosaur losing its relevance. Blogs are where the action is.
I only read story headlines to see what is being ignored and what is being obfuscated at NYT, WaPoo, Kardashian Post and CIA News Network
Huffington (Kardashian)Post was horrible in their Ukraine coverage. Even the Palestians got a better shake. And forget NPR. Pure govt apologia. National Pentagon Radio
The Ukrainian Civil War and the Gaza Genocide will be looked upon in a decade as the beginning of the end of “mainstream” traditional media
Kiev is grabbing people on the streets to exchange them for POW’s. Novorossiya side halted the POW exchange, since the flow of Novorosia POW’s, according to reqused lists, has been replaced by random people, who have nothing to do with Novorossiya. The question is, where are the Novrossiya POW’s – dead?
—
F course they are dead. Prisoners are expensive. Check the organ banks and blood banks in Tel Aviv for what is left
My guess there are mass graves all over Donbass
Dear The Saker,
I think Lavrov is making it very clear where Russia/BRICS et al all stand :).
—
The BRICS
B – Brazil will fold when Soros’ stooge defeats Roussef
I – let’s see where Neoliberal Modi is when he gets his marching orders in DC
S- South Africa. Meh
It’s really the ArCees. Russia and China
Simply because he is Russia’s foreign minister. Have you ever seen the State Secretary of the US using a foreign language to address to the UN?
Carlos RG
—-
Who was his speech aimed at?
1. Russian people to shore up impatience over Putin’s “measured” response in Ukraine
2. English has become the lingua Franca for the world primarily through pop music and movies. The West has demonized Putin as a revanchist Soviet Empiricist.
They still blame Russia for MH17 bc people remember the 1983 KAL incident. In that regard it was a brilliant chose for a false flag
Lavrov could have appealed to the integrated world where through entities like the Web, Facebook, Twitter and YouTube, which are American (English) media outlets
Seems to me Putin is very concerned that Russians hear Lavrov take the moral high road to stem off those in Russia getting tired of Putin’s rope a dope strategy. To convince People that Russia is not he west’s doormat/whipping boy
Russia needs to hire some Western marketers bc their marketing always seems to get lost in the Corporate media maelstrom of “if it bleeds, it leads”. They don’t do subtlety bc of the short attention span of American consumers and the belief our media elites have that Joe Sixpack and Sally Housecoat are too stupid to understand the “nuances” anyway
The Pimsleur Russia listen and speak MP3 series is a great way to learn spoken Russian, and the Berlitz self-teacher book from 1950 is an excellent way to learn to read and write and to understand the grammmar.
^
http://www.pimsleur.com/Learn-Russian/Russian-Phase-1-Units-1-30/9781442312463
*
http://www.amazon.com/Berlitz-Self-Teacher-Russian-English-Edition/dp/0448014262
Another good source for both Russian audio and instruction is the French Assimil series:
http://www.amazon.com/Superpack-Russian-English-speakers-book-Edition/dp/2700580265/ref=pd_sim_b_4/177-2391734-4034608?ie=UTF8&refRID=0N913HX2YBFJZ9J9BERZ
Perhaps Lavrov’s new de facto position as the moral leader of the world….(which Russia has now taken on by default of the US) will encourage English speaking politically minded people to study Russian and the Cyrillic alphabet. During a vacation in Russia this past summer I took a couple of sessions of Russian and can tell you, for instance, that “Peckopah” means “Restaurant”. (P is an R) and it is not that difficult.
Lavrov´s presentation directly in English:
http://webtv.un.org/watch/russia-general-debate-69th-session/3809933432001
Text version:
http://www.un.org/en/ga/69/meetings/gadebate/pdf/RU_en.pdf
lavrow is such a great and capable politician. why, why, why does the west have only $%&/() …aka idiots?
Maybe it is bc they were to long in power w/o any real challenge. I hope that people in the west start to realize that we need a change – and that also includes a change of how “we” deal with our russian brothers.
same time and different kind of brothers: good news from serbia – the gov had the guts to protect the gays having their demonstration. It is a shame that they needed 1000s of police – but same time: thank you serb government! You did the right thing!
I only hope and pray that russia comes to its senses too and understands that they gays are no enemy. The enemy are those politicians like obama who use them for propaganda.
This serbian event – to me and many other gay europeans – is a good sign. why? because after all and understanding how diffiult it is for conservative people, it is a sign into the right direction and – giving some time – it might also open more support from us to you. Payback as in “your protect us” and “we might start to support you”.
this serbian issue is very, very important fo us. understand that many of us do not want to be in conflict with russia. same time what is happening in russia forces us to disagree. that is stupid. we never picked you as an enemy. our “leaders” did.
Putin has Lavrov, Obama has John “How Do You Ask a Man to be the Last Man to Die for a Mistake?” Kerry
Advantage Putin
http://en.itar-tass.com/russia/751732
No one is paying attention in America, Canada or Australia but the rest of the world is nodding in agreement with the belligerent evil of an immoral west
http://en.itar-tass.com/russia/751715
In the same way that Bush Jr purged the State Dept of Arabists to make way for the Harvard Likudist meme that Arabs are big talkers and cowards
The same bereft intellectual American Exceptionalist anti Russian mindset has degraded the State Dept
I think that after Obama and Kerry masterminded the MH17 takedown that the world would shun Russia in total a la the Muslim World post 9-11
Obama and Kerry are politicians. They forgot Putin comes from a different space.
Advantage Russia
As I try to embrace a Sakerian (how you like that!) view on Putin’s long game rather than be one of Alien Tech’s “benighted” trolls along with sister Katherine, lol…
Anyone think that Putin has deputized Lavrov in a full court press..? He has been everywhere lately
Putin sees himself as anathema to any dialogue with a west brought up on comic book “evil” villains like Saddam, Qadaffi and Bin Laden
So he removes himself from the focus and sends Lavrov out to make the argument that Russia supports negotiations and the West are whiny bullies
What kind of Dictator does that?***
****this snark’s for you Weird-Wolf :)
http://en.ria.ru/world/20140928/193396806/Lavrov-US-Base-Their-Statements-on-Ukraine-on-Unverified-Facts.html
http://en.ria.ru/world/20140928/193395845/DPR-Ukrainian-Forces-Exchange-Prisoners-in-30-to-60-Format.html
Hamas trades 10 for 1….
Does anyone know how the prisoners are exchanged on the NAF side
Surely they are not exchanging Uki officers or Neo Nazi irregulars out of uniform
Hopefully they are the miserable conscripts 50 and older and thus too long in the tooth just to be cannon fodder in the inevitable Uki counter offensive when the “ceasefire” ends
V of Russia was not shut down, per se, but merged in July 2014 with RIA Novosti.
http://www.en.ria.ru
However putin gets blamed for that one, it pales to his setting up that next to useless RT, which barely rates above plain vanilla MSM.
There’s also pravda.ru (irony: pravda= truth), & ITAR TASS
en.itar-tass.com
Like Paul on the road to Damascus, I am trying to view everything through the Sakerian viewfinder
But this article makes me viscerally agree. My heart is overruling my head
The only I disagree with in this article is I do NOT want Regime change in Moscow. I want Putin to bite back….but I am coming around to Saker’s advice to not expect immediate reaction
In reggae there is a common lyric: don’t mistake my kindness for weakness. Is there a Russian equivalent sentiment?
Troll alert /jk
http://en.ria.ru/analysis/20140927/193353470/Foreign-Affairs-Analyst-Russia-Should-Show-Some-Teeth-in.html
http://en.ria.ru/analysis/20140927/193353470/Foreign-Affairs-Analyst-Russia-Should-Show-Some-Teeth-in.html
Lavrov again. If the AngloZiomists ignore it, it plays well at home and in the rest of the Neocolonial world
I could listen to him all day. The Chinese need to echo his lead. After Russia and Syria are “liberated” China must know it is next
http://en.ria.ru/politics/20140928/193398654/Lavrov-Ukraine-in-Need-of-Deep-Constitutional-Reform-.html
—
My new hero. He is “foaming the runway” to say, “we tried to reason with you but our patience has limits”
Gerry2012
Mr.Lavrov speaks impeccable English so why he chose to speak Russian is beyond me.
Serendipity
It is quite clear (to me,at least) that Lavrov should have delivered his speech in English (as we’ve seen, he speaks English quite well).
Alien Tech
Why is Lavrov talking in Russian? If he wants to influence people in other countries he should have talked in English because other wise we only hear the lies and nothing from the other side.
Classic Troll Fail. There should be a video for this
Veritas
Many thanks for the Ria Novosti suggestion. I like Lavrov….Currently he seems to be the only diplomat familiar with real diplomacy. The kind unknown to Washington. Would you happen to know whether there is an ap for Ria Novosti for my Android? Cannot find one. I have RT/AlJareera and Press TV but no Ria Novosti…
Again many thanks
G.
I uploaded an english only version of the Lavrov speech at
http://youtu.be/uKXU1k8r8tc
lowered the pitch of the female interpreter’s voice as much as I could without making it too artificial and did some other mods — easier to listen to than the right channel of the multiplexed version…
greencrow
There are far more English speakers accross the world than there are Russian speakers. All HS in the Netherlands for instance require English and French as a choice..English is a “required” language while Russian is not. Lavrov was not addressing Russia but the world. The world does not speak Russian. English is MY second language so your arrogance is based on ignorance, as it so often is. Ever engaged in thinking??? You might be surprised. Have a good one!
I spent three hours listening to Russian language tapes today. It’s a nice language, not so difficult to learn, and very beautiful.
Classic Troll Fail. There should be a video for this
@Amerikanski
These are most certainly NOT trolls. Grow up. If everyone thought exactly the same way we would be drooling bots and this site would be just Saker and his fan club
All of those people you besmirched are rooting for Putin and the NR to succeed. As do I.
Troll: Cold N. Haufield at Moon of Alabama
There is more than one way to skin a cat. Constructive criticism for “our” team. Putin is a huge underdog and needs encouragement not blind sycophancy
Gerry1211 said…
There are far more English speakers across the world than there are Russian speakers. All HS in the Netherlands for instance require English and French as a choice..English is a “required” language while Russian is not. Lavrov was not addressing Russia but the world. The world does not speak Russian.
Right. It’s true that native English speakers tend to believe (perhaps a bit arrogantly) that everyone else should learn English, but the fact is that English is the de facto international language (as Latin was in Europe for centuries). There is surely some reason (other than the prevalence of American movies) for learning English to be (almost) obligatory in European high schools (also in Asia). Native French speakers may grind their teeth in frustration, but the fact is that English is the world’s lingua franca. As Gerry1211 said, in his UNGS speech Lavrov was addressing the world, not just Russia. Therefore he should have delivered his speech in English. Attempts to render it via what the interpreter said are just not good enough. The Russians have a few things to learn about how to present their position to the rest of the world, and let’s hope they wise up real soon.
Anunnaki, it is a classic troll as I said, because it is irrelevant to the subject and can be argued about till the cows come home without ever addressing the subject — which is I think the content and significance of Lavrov’s speech.
Recall Obama’s tan suit? Troll bait. What did he say? Who knows among all those English speakers who heard him? But they damn well have an opinion about his wardrobe.
“Grow up”
Cheap flame.
“All of those people you besmirched are rooting for Putin and the NR to succeed. As do I.”
So, there is Lavrov denouncing the English speaking governments and politicians and asserting the national rights of all nations which the English speaking nations aggressively stress and destroy in front of the assembly of those nations and you think he ought to have spoken to them of this matter in English.
One fool makes a hundred.
Anunnaki maybe the impatience in actions is due to growing up in a western,r Russian, Chinese, Indian culture. As you know if someone does wrong to you, you get in their face and confront them about it. It would also be uncommon for them to keep shaking hands and behave amicably in the US. With Russians, they will behave the same way as before until they are ready and then show you the door. It might take years for that to happen. The best example of this is how Obama would not be seen with Putin since Putin threw a spanner in the works and the scene between Putin and Poroshenko. I had a hard time understand how Putin could smile at him and shake his hand at the guy who kept demonizing him and calling for his death.
It is difficult to always keep in the back of your mind that they are different cultures since we can all talk to each other so readily. Even when you work with them every day you still forget they dont think like you do. On the other hand you have some south Americans who have a dance party after getting clobbered and thats how they grieve.
English is not Lavrov’s native language. I’ve heard him give interviews in English and sometimes the sentence construction is a little bit off, or the word choice is not quite right. You don’t want him parodied by Jon Stewart. Translators are professional and **hopefully** will get all the nuances right.
Well, this is good news, sort of. I wish they’d make it more public & explicit though.
http://www.wnd.com/2014/09/russia-threatens-to-retaliate-against-u-s-military/
What happens if/ when the US (or a US proxy like Qatar/ Saudi Arabia/ UAE) calls the Russian bluff and takes out some Assad Government assets?
It’d be nice if it was on the record rather than via backchannels.
Surely they understand the world’s media will act surprised that Russia would have a problem with US targeting of Assad if they don’t make it explicit that they will defend Assad?
They just allow themselves to be blamed/ framed for an escalation.
Alien Tech you are quite correct. The Empire ensures that all international bodies are headed by stooges. If they stop obeying orders, they are got rid of, like Jose Bustani at the Chemical Weapons Convention, or Boutros-Ghali. But if reliable they are pushed forward, witness the bullying in order to appoint Japanese stooge Amano to the IAEA to lean on Iran etc, etc. I just think that Kofi Annan is a particularly egregious example of an Imperial Stooge.
Gerry and others banging on about the use of English.
Yes, congratulations on being able to speak English. Well done! Sincerely.
However, what none of you are is diplomats.
Yes, Lavrov was addressing an audience from around the world but those in front of him were also diplomats.
Diplomacy is all about meanings and interpretations – kinda like lawyering in that respect.
When Lavrov speaks he does so in a deliberate manner. When he wants meaning to be clear, he is very clear. When he wants his meaning to be open to some degree of interpretation then his words reflect that.
If he speaks in English then he simply can not express himself with the same degree of nuance – none of us can – unless our demands of communication are very basic ‘want food’, ‘want sex’, ‘you pretty woman’.
Around the world people will be examining Lavrov’s words for hidden meanings, trying to find wiggle room that was not intended.
When he speaks the document of record becomes the transcript or recording of what was said. So, it is important to use the best and most clear language for the speaker.
Speaking in Russian is a precaution, a way to ensure that meaning is not lost – after all, the world is full of very competent translators, less well endowed with people who are as good at diplomacy as Lavrov.
There is also, probably, a secondary level involved here. By speaking in Russian Lavrov is making sure that the important part of his audience will have to work just a little harder to understand him, this means that they will pay more attention to his words, even if they read them as a translated transcript rather than as hurriedly taken notes as he spoke. That is good for all of us because we need for the power actors to understand what Russia is saying. We are in this pretty pickle because too many people were too lazy to bother to listen and learn.
Amerikanski….
“Anunnaki, it is a classic troll as I said, because it is irrelevant to the subject and can be argued about till the cows come home without ever addressing the subject — which is I think the content and significance of Lavrov’s speech.”
And the subject was what? If it was to show the world that the U.S. was/is wrong (it is!) it flew by everyone because it wasn’t in English…a BIG mistake!
“Recall Obama’s tan suit? Troll bait. What did he say? Who knows among all those English speakers who heard him? But they damn well have an opinion about his wardrobe.”
You cannot stick to the subject can you? Whatever Obama “says” is in English.
“Grow up”
Cheap flame.”
Really time to grow up and engage in some thinking
“All of those people you besmirched are rooting for Putin and the NR to succeed. As do I.”
They sure do.
“So, there is Lavrov denouncing the English speaking governments and politicians and asserting the national rights of all nations which the English speaking nations aggressively stress and destroy in front of the assembly of those nations and you think he ought to have spoken to them of this matter in English.”
If his aim was to have that message understood by Washington and the majority of American brain-dead by addressing the UN in Russian he failed miserably. If his aim was to address the Africans Swahili might have helped, but “blasting the U.S. in Russian is like me blasting you in Dutch. It is nonsense. Mr. Lavrov is most likely the only real diplomat we have walking the globe. He is extremely intelligent, analyzes the issues well and seeks solutions. In the process he recognizes and condemns those who don’t want solutions, exposes their hypocrisy and only want war for their own gain because it i lucrative. When we have a message to deliver to an adversary we do so in a language not only the adversary understands but most of its people who have been programmed to the point of being brain dead do. Are you with me so far. An that ain’t Russian honey!!!
Before you decide to write again I suggest you do some thinking…Mijn volgende antwoord is in het Nederlands. Argumenteer dat maar.
Duty
“Gerry and others banging on about the use of English.
Yes, congratulations on being able to speak English. Well done! Sincerely.
However, what none of you are is diplomats.”
And obviously neither are you. And, so it seems, neither have you lived long enough to gain any wisdom on the subject in order to have an opinion.
You have some growing up to do in order to participate in grown up discussions.
PS perhaps you can point out 1 American diplomat in Washington (John Kerry is a politician not a diplomat)or even 1 American diplomat at the U.N. Samantha Powers is not a diplomat. So do you have a definition what a diplomat IS, since Washington seems to be clueless. Over to you!!!
Re Gerry1211 said..29 September, 2014 15:19
Although perhaps not obvious, not only is Mr. Lavrov intelligent he also has a sense of humour as well as precision.
One of the tools/expectations of Empire is that they should always be addressed in their own language – a kind of rendering tribute.
Which language did the General speak in the first press conference giving Russia’s initial thoughts on MH17?
Which language was used by the representative of the same organisation in the subsequent MH17 conference, and with what facility?
Why was such a “bad” translator used to convey the General’s message into English – of a sort in the first conference?
Why is Psaki such a useful tool?
Which languages were used at the Minsk conference?
Okay I apologize, it was mu mistake. After seeing Lavrov’s interview I thought this was another interview given to the press. I did not realize it was his speech to the UN. And I agree he should give it in his native tongue since there are legal implications in it. Yea I know Americans get in front of it and lie like they are talking to a porn channel viewer ship.
Anonymous
“Although perhaps not obvious, not only is Mr. Lavrov intelligent he also has a sense of humour as well as precision”
A sense of humor requires intelligence.
As far as I recall the first Russian information re MH17 was initially in Russian with a painfully poor translator Saker even referred to it.Later it had English sub titles. Worked for me. The second report, the result of Russian engineers was in English.
The issue here is that when it comes from Russia I can accept Russian and am willing to wait for decent subtitles or a translation. Their translators are atrocious. But when a man like Lavrov stands in front of the International Community he needs to address them in English. When Frans Timmerman’s Minister of Defence (Netherlands) addressed the U.N. on the MH17 issue he spoke in English. He lied through his teeth but that’s beside the point. The brain dead Dutch sought he was cool and should be rewarded by going to Bussels. While I am glad the Dutch will be well rid of him, he may just prove a far bigger disaster for the EU as a whole. Those who end up in Brussels are almost always the rejects in their own country.Timmermans is an opportunist.
Perhaps it is now clear that Lavrov spoke to the UNGA, and his speech was not off-the-cuff remarks to US reporters in New York.
As a significant speech by a senior Russian diiplomat, be assured every phrase and word was chosen carefully. Consideration would have been given to Russia’s allies; India and China may have been consulted. The speech would have been translated by the Kremlin in English and French certainly, and probably Spanish, and maybe German — all before Lavrov arrived in New York. Various delegations would have already produced executive summaries and talking points for their press offices.
So, I read US news websites dated the same day as Lavrov’s speech quoting a “UN transcript” of his speech in English. Perhaps people in other countries can note the dateline on their news services quoting the speech in their native language.
Or perhaps the doubters might call the Russian delegation at the UN, or if they have a Russian Consulate in their city, and find out how the speech was made available and in which languages.
So, the actual delivery of the speech by Lavrov was ‘spectacle’, ‘performance’, but it was not the substance of the political and diplomatic activity, which occurs off-camera always.
“When Frans Timmerman’s Minister of Defence (Netherlands) addressed the U.N. on the MH17 issue he spoke in English.”
English is an official (recognized regional) language of the Netherlands.
“The Netherlands has a tradition of learning foreign languages, formalized in Dutch education laws. Some 87% of the total population indicate they are able to converse in English, 70% in German, and 29% in French. Children start with English courses at primary schools when they are about four or five years old.”
Wikipedia entry Netherlands
Gerry1211 said…29 September, 2014 18:21
You appear oblivious to the key driver namely
“One of the tools/expectations of Empire is that they should always be addressed in their own language – a kind of rendering tribute.”
At the UN you can have simultaneous translation in many languages – one of the reasons delegates often use earphones.
Gerry, thanks for your comment and thanks for kinda making the point about lack of comprehension for me.
If you read what I wrote you will see that I made no reference to Kerry or anyone else, I was referring to solely to Lavrov and his speech before the UN.
Although you are correct that Kerry is a politician you are incorrect to suggest that he is not engaged in diplomacy. Lavrov is also a government minister but his diplomatic skills are never in question and nobody ever needs to make excuses for him as you have for Kerry. That shows there is a qualitative difference between them in terms of their relative skill sets, although they are nominally peers.
It is hard for people like you to understand what happens around you; but, again, congratulations because you are at least present in this forum and so you have given yourself the chance to learn.
You might want to learn what some of the words we use around here mean because then you will not make mistakes based upon your lack of vocabulary skill.
If there’s something that you do not understand, rather than flying off the handle as you seem to have done in posting a somewhat intemperate reply to my comment about the use of English, ask a question! There’s no shame in asking about that which we do not understand.
If you don’t agree with my (or anyone else’s) analysis of a situation or case then question it, give your fact supported opinion, let us all learn from your insights.
It appears some think the simultaneous translation is significant. I have argued it is not. What is official is the Russian translation and which was already in the diplomatic pouches before Lavrov mounted the podium.
Here is a link to all the official Kremlin English translations of Lavrov’s speeches and interviews.
http://www.mid.ru/bdomp/brp_4.nsf/english
Certain people of Atlanticist sentiments here may want to bookmark the page for future reference.
English TRANSCRIPT
“Address by Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov to the 69th session of the UN General Assembly, New York, 27 September 2014” is here:
http://www.mid.ru/bdomp/brp_4.nsf/e78a48070f128a7b43256999005bcbb3/cdea7854ff002b5a44257d62004f7236!OpenDocument
——–
Lavrov’s press conference, the day prior to his speech at the UNGA is gradually being translated to English here:
http://www.mid.ru/brp_4.nsf/0/698C62A41ECD6B3D44257D62003EE97C
Main page
http://www.mid.ru/bdomp/brp_4.nsf/main_eng